Morning Read: A Muslim-owned summer camp for the Adirondacks
The Albany Times-Union is reporting this morning that one of the US’s largest Islamic organizations has acquired more than 100 acres of land in the Adirondack Park town of Lake Luzerne and hopes to build a new summer camp.
The Islamic Circle of North America, a Muslim advocacy group based in New York City, hopes to raise money to develop a camp for children and families of all religions on land donated to it last year, Muhammad Rahman, ICNA’s secretary general, said in an interview Thursday.
“Once we have some resources, we will submit a plan to the community,” Rahman said. “Then we’ll see what happens.”
“It’s kind of their business, and it’s probably a good thing,” Steve Mackey, co-owner of Luzerne Market, said of the ICNA’s plans. “We’re Americans, a melting pot.”
Mackey checked with his employees to find out their thoughts and said that he didn’t expect the issue to explode into a controversy the way the plans for a Muslim community center near the World Trade Center site in Manhattan did last year.
The camp would operate in a part of the Park that’s been a popular locale for Christian summer camps for decades.
Tags: adirondacks, religion
No objection to camps for any religion but would object to any camp run by any religion if the plan was to invite children of all faiths or no faith because then the purpose is to sneak in religious teaching.
I have no objection to a Muslim-owned camp provided they’re good neighbors, like most Muslims are. There are many Christian-owned camps and properties in the Adirondacks.
As for Mr. Mackey’s observation, he is probably right. There shouldn’t be any controversy unless, like Park51, venal, self-interested politicians choose to fan flames of divisionism in order to enhance their electoral chances. Hopefully, we’re better than that.
Outside forces, seeking to gain from controversy ( right-wing nuts like Beck, Limbaugh, Fox News, and politically conservative candidates), might likely try to make something out of it. Then left-liberal media and groups could respond with outrage, to likewise gain ratings, funding, and influence with their constituencies. And so it could go.
Hopefully,sensible locals expressing opinions as cited above would spoil the fun before it got to far.
Pete if it is a Muslim camp I would certainly hope they teach Islam! They would be hypocrites if they did not. That is a fine thing to do, just like at Camp Guggenheim your own faith teaches the Catholic religion to kids from throughout the North Country.
I can’t believe this is somehow unique or the first Muslim camp in the US? I hope its not unique this is part of what America is about.
I do agree Pete with you on the idea of pretending to be non-religious then pulling the classic bait and switch with the subtle messages. Nothing wrong with being an overtly religious camp.
Ho-hum. Does everyone know that Muslims and Sikhs have been buying up gas stations all around the country? And Hindus operate many motels? And what about the Chinese opening restaurants in every town? Does anyone ask them to renounce Chairman Mao?
So no one has a problem with Muslims having a camp to teach kids how to Kill Americans . Has evey one forgot 9/11 ? Public Radio is the voice of Liberals / But come on we need to stop this camp from ever happening . Let them send there kids to the Middle East to go to camp . Not Here
Knuck, when those Chinese start demanding communist reforms in the US, then yes, I imagine there will be a backlash.
What are the reforms Muslims are demanding? When did they lose their freedom of speech? Or freedom of religion?
Do I detect some religious intolerance or prejudice?
Beep beep beep. Gotta go shut off my bigotry detector.
But they are all Americans.
I think the concern about Islamic Law would be the same concern people may have about Christians wanting to impose our ideas, such as restricting abortion or Blue Laws etc. The concern is fine and so is the advocacy it is the nature of freedom.
Not at all Knuck. What I’m referring to is the Muslims who are making noise throughout the world trying to have Sharia Law enacted where they reside. That’s neither bigotry, intolerance or prejudice. Those terms however might well be applied to the Muslims that are seeking to have special treatment for themselves, or laws which would punish infidels severely.
I have zero problem with anyone exercising their freedom of speech as long as they realize I also have the freedom to disagree, and as long as they aren’t advocating violent overthrow of various gov’ts, countries or religions. Even then, there is a difference between language and action. After all, our Beloved and Glorious Leader recommended his supporters punish their enemies and mentioned what would be considered violent action had a “right wing kook” said it. But since the words were uttered by The One we know he really didn’t mean for SIEU thugs to actually knife and shoot Tea Party activists. OTH, when Muslim leaders speak of wiping Israel and all the Infidels from the face of the earth……I kinda get the impression they are being a little more literal than, say,, Sarah Palin in her “…don;t retreat, reload…” remark.
I agree Bret.
Many of these Islamic groups are just modern Nazi’s. Groups like Hamas the Muslim Brotherhood are racist anti-Semites who promote genocide against the Jewish people. Netanyahu has said is that the Jews have learned from history that when someone says they are going to kill every Jew, we should believe them. Now just like the Aryan Nations have the right to buy property in the Adirondacks groups that support Hamas also have that right, just as long as they are open to the same critique that we would give a KKK or Aryan Nation group that wanted to have a camp there.
But also we must realize that every Muslim group does not support Hamas or the Muslim Brotherhood. Frankly though even if they do they can still buy property wherever they choose.
Actually Palestinians are Semitic people, so it is unlikely Hamas is anti-semitic. If you mean anti-jew just say anti-jew.
The Irish Republican Army were Irish but I never believed all Irish were bomb makers and killers even though some were. Many Americans supported the IRA.
Not all Catholics are child molesters even though many of their heiarchy have been shown to be child molesters.
Not all gays are psycho-killer cannibals even though Jeffery Dahmer was.
Increasing the hate rhetoric against Muslims doesn’t help to decrease the anger among Moslems. It just makes it worse. Millions of good loyal Americans are being smeared by the sort of hate speech evident on this blog.
By the way, I know for a fact that Muslims and Muslim sympathizers have been infiltrating Lake Luzerne for decades. So if you’re worried you better watch out…they could be your neighbors.
All true Knuck, and not every right winger believes Obama is a Muslim, born in Aftrica, that FEMA is setting up prison camps, that we must protect the rich at all costs. Sarah Palin never said she could see Russia from her house. The Tea Party isn’t about our having a black president. Yet all the hate and distortions from the left would have you believe all garbage listed above is true. So, it works both ways.
Free speech is free speech. If a Muslim group supports Hamas or the Muslim Brotherhood; both have declared they wish to exterminate the Jewish people, then they are no better than a Nazi supporter. Is it hate speech to call out the KKK or the Aryan Nations for what they believe? The leader of Hamas has stated he hopes that all Jews do return to Israel as then they would all be in one place so they would be easier to exterminate. The leader of the Catholic Church or the Irish president has not said yes I hope the IRA kills more children, or the Pope has not said the Church stands firmly behind molesting children. So it is different from that perspective.
We need to keep a light shined on the holocaust deniers etc which inhabit many Islamic movements. I think that it is healthy to do so. Holocaust denial may play well other places but here we have an obligation to call out these groups.
I don’t really care about the “anger” among Muslims their anger is there problem mine. However I totally agree many if not most Muslim groups in the US do not support hate groups like Hamas and like I said even if they did they would still have a right fully protected to start whatever kind of camp they want, just like any other group regardless of what they believe.
To be fair, I think we need to realize there are shared elements among the world’s to largest evangelical religions, the Muslims and the Christians. Both have a tendency to try to use governments to enforce their religious laws.
When our founders called for the separation of church and state, they were thinking about the various Christian denominations and how one denomination would cram down its beliefs on all others through secular law if they could get away with it.
Don’t forget the Holy Roman Empire and how it persecuted pagans once it was no longer being persecuted by the pagan Roman Empire.
When Pilot asked Jesus what was truth, Jesus didn’t answer because, I believe, he knew each person who claims to know what is true has a bad tendency to use it as an excuse to persecute those who think otherwise.
I don’t have a problem with any religion just so long as they don’t try cramming down their truth using secular laws to do it.
“Does everyone know that Muslims and Sikhs have been buying up gas stations all around the country? And Hindus operate many motels? And what about the Chinese opening restaurants in every town? Does anyone ask them to renounce Chairman Mao?”
The Irish bar-owners are a plague on this nation. THEY. MUST. BE. STOPPED.
Pete, the Founders never endorsed the idea of a separation of Church and State as we understand it or are told they did today. They endorsed the idea that the State could not mandate a religion, ie- Britian and the Church of England, that one group should be given special status because of their religion. According to todays revisionist scholars our Founders were practically atheists that never looked to their faith for guidance. Simply reading the words of the Founders themselves disputes this idea overwhelmingly.
As with free speech or assembly or religion, your right to exercise your right stops when it harms another. Let the Muslims, Christians, Jews, Hindus, etc. all say what they will, worship as they see fit. Let them practice what they will until the line is reached. Trying to impose religious law, Sharia Law, in place of civil laws would be crossing that line.
The thing to avoid in my opinion is the idea that there are ‘good’ Muslims and “bad” Muslims. The good ones don’t really take Islam very seriously and are not conservative in how they practice their faith, they are groovy and open to all faiths and are a religion of peace. It is not up to non-Muslims to dictate what acceptable Islam to Muslims is.
Sure they cannot break our constitution. However we are not France, they indeed have the right to wear a veil, to have traditional roles for men and women and to practice arranged marriages if that is what they want. They are also allowed to proselytize and attract new converts.
So in this case for me it is not relevant what this Muslim camp is about as far as what they teach. If they teach fundamentalist Islam that is fine. I think it is dangerous when people in the US usually secular liberals try to push this view about what Muslims really believe as some sort of justification for the practice of their faith. It should not matter what they believe.
On the other hand I have the right and obligation to point out some of the more noxious beliefs that some parts of conservative Islam holds.
All it takes is one loudmouth crackpot quoted endlessly on right-wing media to distort everyones view of reality.
I give up.
You see why Fox News is money well spent, Knuck.
Free speech is a dangerous thing I guess.
Jeeze Knuck, all the left wing crack pots being quoted constantly on TV don’t alter peoples views either? Listen, research and decide for yourself.