Morning Read: New York’s Property Tax Nightmare
The Albany Times Union lays out the argument bluntly:
Property taxes in New York state are a confusing, unfair, labyrinthine disaster. As a result of unfair and inappropriate tax burdens, regular folks are losing their homes or finding themselves teetering on the brink of financial disaster. And no one in government is doing anything to stop to stop the nightmare.
The article published on-line lays out gripping stories that illustrate how soaring property tax rates are impacting people with low incomes. One example cited is that of Clarence Petty, who lived on Corey’s Road near Tupper Lake.
It seems as if everybody knew Clarence Petty, the late conservationist that some called “the Adirondack man.” Even Hillary Clinton posed for a picture with him once. But few realized that the man who fought so hard to preserve the land – the wilderness of the Adirondacks – was in fear of losing his own.
It would be interesting to see the affect of a large group of people delaying their property tax payments to either the county or the school. I am not advocating Non-Payment of taxes, but to simply delay them for six to nine months. For budgets that didn’t carry an adequate fund balance forward, there might be a bit of a pinch. Could you get enough people to do it long enough to get the taxing entity to pay attention?
I’m not sure about everyone else out their, but my school taxes and land taxes have continued to go up. St. Lawrence County is looking at the potential of some pretty stiff increases this year. Are these guys not getting the picture?
Usually I can pontificate on anything even when I don’t know what I am talking about. But I honestly don’t understand what is going on in NYS with our property taxes and our taxes in general? I just don’t understand it. Part of my extended family who lives in the Midwest are shocked what we pay in property taxes and it is not as if they live in states that are poor or have poor schools. On 100K home we would pay in SLC in some of our villages close to 4000, this is insane, this same property would run between 1000-2000 in many other states. They have good schools and good public services at least as good as we have in upstate NY. So what is going on? It is not like we are just a little higher, these rates are triple, 300% higher than in many other states. So anyway long winded way of saying I don’t understand it.
Bush- they simply don’t care. To be completely bunt, our County Administrator is an idiot who got her job through the old boy (girl) network. Our County Board of Legislators needs to be disbanded ASAP or replaced completely, I prefer the former since I have no real representation at the County level. I have what amounts to a mercenary representing my interests, someone who neither lives in my town or has property or other vested interest in this town.
Beyond that, St Lawrence County is controlled by the elite few in Canton/Potsdam. Johnson Newspapers/St Lawrence University determine what will be and not be to the greatest extent. They don’t care what happens as long as their bread is buttered.
Over 50% of our county tax burden in SLC is medicade costs. Our local politicians have no control over that. Another big cost is county employee health insurance costs and retirement system expenses, which again, are determined in Albany. Very little of the cost of running our county government is actually in local hands. The same is true of our schools. I once heard that about 5% of our local school budget is actually in local hands and that 5% funds the programs that nobody would want to cut … sports, extra-curriculars, etc. I don’t have answers, but I would encourage everyone to avoid looking for simple solutions to this very complex situation.
Albany’s unfunded mandates are suffocating counties and municipalities.
I believe last year in the county I live in, discretionary spending (the non-mandated spending the county actually has control over) decreased by 1 pct… which itself is no mean feat because of health care costs for employees… and yet taxes went up 4 pct thanks primarily to Medicaid.
A good example: a few years ago, the state mandated that every school district buy AEDs (the devices used to resuscitate heart attack victims). I believe they required that every school and athletic venue have at least one. The school district I live in has 6 schools and at least 6 athletic venues… and the schools actually have one for each floor. They had to buy at least two dozen of these AEDs, probably more… at $12,000 a pop! Do you think Albany gave them any money for this mandate? Whose pockets do you think it came out of? Local taxpayers.
The answer to the question is in the TU article:
“In fact, “outside New York City” is the asterisk for all property tax debate and the statistics discussed here, because that’s where the problem is — much of it driven by a state legislature dominated by city interests, which mandates what local governments do without providing money to pay for it. Public schools account for almost two-thirds of local property tax burden outside New York City, and their annual costs per student now range from about $15,000 to $25,000 per year, far above the national norm.”
This is not just “far above the norm” it is about 50% higher than the national average.
This is true, yet voters, even in upstate NY, support democratic candidates with strong ties to NYC(like Andrew Cuomo and Chuck Schumer). It is the voters fault,plain and simple. Upstate voters mostly want to complain,until they start doing something nothing will change.
I know that much of the costs are indeed out of the local control and flow from the state level.
Why does NYS Medicaid cost so much more than other states Medicaid costs?
Mervel, I think the costs are high on Medicaid because the costs are high. When I lived in Colorado out property taxes were low partially because we didn’t have these costs, the same is true today. The population was low, and the population was young and healthy so our Medicaid costs were low.
What supports the better dynamic? Business. The businesses bring in young workers and they pay their share of taxes. It is doubly good for keeping property tax low.
This is largely the fault of NYC politicians who refuse to allow an up or down vote on a property tax cap in the Assembly, any sort of reform of the medicaid program, or any sort of mandate reform.
State labor law also hurts. For example, when a collective bargaining agreement between a local government and union expire, the workers still get automatic pay increases. Try getting any concessions from a union in that situation.
I’ve heard the unfunded mandate, Medicare/Medicaid argument for years. While I’m sure it’s a complex system with unseen costs and effects, it’s seems to me our County Board of Legislators could simply say “No.” to further spending mandates and costs. Were 7 or 8 northern counties to get together and refuse to play along with Albany then perhaps something would happen to better the situation.
Meanwhile, back in Canton, our Legislators never seem to have heard the word “No.” when it comes to discretionary spending.
It’s pretty simple. NY was the Empire State and funding government through a regressive property tax system worked fine when our state was growing and vital in terms of industry, population, etc.
But we are now on the other end of the curve with population and business declining while at the same time the infrastructure that was put in place 50 or 75 years ago has begun to crumble. At the same time we still want to fund everything that we did before and add high tech gizmo funding to everything.
The cycle will turn again once a whole generation who moved to Florida begins to pass on and global warming makes the south less inviting. Meanwhile the question is do we reform our tax system and try to continue to be the Empire State or do we allow the decline to continue and become a southern state up north.
Upstate IS a southern state right now, we just have much higher taxes than the rest of the southern states.
A lot of what you say is true Knuck, but no one in Albany gives two hoots. NY wants your business…..to pay taxes and fees.
Ogdensburg Free Academy – Contract settled which includes provisions for union members to contribute to their health care premiums. At first glance, one would think that progress has been made in cost sharing. You might think that until you read about the negotiated raises for the three years of the contract. 3.95% – 3.8% – 3.75% Who else is getting those type of increases? Check with your parents to see if they got a 3.95% increase in the SS check. Compare the “premium contribution” to the salary increases and you’ll see that the taxpayer is coming out with the crap end of the stick AGAIN.
Hammond – 3.2% tax levy increase – Ask you parents again about the increase in their SS check. Did you get a 3% pay increase at your job? Do you still have a job? I don’t think Hammond’s tax increase is anything to Croh about.