Why the (groovy) 60s still matter

This year's Winter Carnival button created by cartoonist Gary Trudeau

This year’s Winter Carnival button created by cartoonist Gary Trudeau

UPDATE:

We’ve had some critical feedback about the lack of discussion, so far, of Vietnam, which obviously was one of the major catalysts for all that happened in the 1960s.  I think that’s fair.

We’re trying to establish a balance here between the fun and nostalgia and celebration of a winter carnival and the opportunity to have an interesting conversation about a part of our history that’s still powerfully intimately relevant.

But Vietnam is just too big and too powerful an event in our national experience not to be front and center in a conversation like this one.  Rest assured that the topic will be on the table tonight in Saranac Lake and as we continue our discussion here.  Hope you’ll join in with your thoughts and memories.  — Brian, NCPR

Origional Post

This month, Saranac Lake’s Winter Carnival theme is the Groovy 60s.  One of the coolest parts of Carnival season is always the annual theme.  People work wonders finding creative ways to bring the Celts or Space Invaders or Medieval Knights to life.  (One of my favorite moments in the Adirondacks was encountering two knights in shining armor on horseback next to the old Dew Drop Inn).

But this is year is more special than most.  This year for many of us, the theme is a blast and a party and a reason to drag out our old tie-dye, but it’s also living history.  We were actually there.  The last few weeks, my Facebook page has lit up with people sharing photographs of themselves in the 1960s.  We’ve been catching glimpses of each other, wrinkle free, with fresh eyes, our gray hair still decades in the future.

Already as part of this winter’s Carnival we’ve had a revival of “Hair,” the classic 60s musical (which opened in 1967) and coming up this week there will be a revue of music from the period.  Also, tonight, a bunch of us are gathering at Historic Saranac Lake (5pm, more information here) to talk more in-depth about what that decade meant.

It should be a great conversation.  NCPR’s Ellen Rocco will be there to talk about her work as an organizer and activist.  We’ll also hear from George Nagle, a member of Saranac Lake’s clergy who was arrested in the South during the civil rights era.  Howard Riley, one of the Adirondacks’ best local historians, will talk about Saranac Lake in the 60s.

George Nagle was an activist during the civil rights era and will speak this evening at Historic Saranac Lake

George Nagle was an activist during the civil rights era and will speak this evening at Historic Saranac Lake

The goal of the conversation isn’t to set aside the fun and nostalgia.  It’s pretty wonderful how the art and music and sense of hope of the 60s still feels alive and relevant.  (While writing this, I’m listening to Neil Young’s first album…)  But it’s important, I think, to connect the dots between the fun stuff and the big, almost overwhelming shifts that happened between 1960 and 1970.

A fun decade, but also big and challenging and scary

From the invention of the birth control pill to the first televised presidential debate to the civil rights movement and the rise of environmentalism, we still inhabit the big conversation begun in those tumultuous years.

We still idolize the Greatest Generation that came up during the Depression and fought the Second World War.  But really, it’s not Eisenhower or Truman who resonate and clang about in our lives.  It’s Richard Nixon and Lyndon Johnson and John Kennedy and Martin Luther King Jr. who we still grapple with now.

Here’s why I think the 60s still matter so profoundly.  That decade marked the first time that Americans seriously questioned the great consensus of what it meant to be a “real” American.  Prior to the movements of that decade, our society tolerated a fair amount of difference.  But it was clearly understand what it meant to be “normal.”

Normal was white, Christian (mostly protestant), English-speaking, and heterosexual.  Normal was an America where men held positions of nearly unquestioned privilege, where a husband’s dominant role in religious life, commerce, and in the home was considered as natural as gravity.

During the 1960s, we started unpacking those assumptions.  We started to experiment not just with new kinds of tolerance, but with actual acceptance.  We tested the idea that people living very different lives from our own might be, in their own way, just as normal as ourselves.

It turns out that’s one of the most radical, scary, controversial ideas we humans have ever come up with.  It challenges our deep tribal and racial assumptions.

Half a century later, we’re all a lot grayer, a little bit slower off the bench maybe, but those are still the very questions we’re trying to answer.  And we’re doing it in very different ways.  Some of us have stuck to a fairly traditional set of ideas.  They lament the “real” America and see the 60s as a moment when our society went off the rails.

Another group of us are angry that the full idealism of the 60s hasn’t been realized yet.  Many see that era as a failure because its full promise is still an ideal, and not a reality.

The American Carnival?

I see it a little differently.  I think we live pretty much entirely in the world produced by that revolutionary decade.  Even the most conservative of us have passed through a lot of doors, accepted a lot of big new ideas.  And the fact that we still argue and debate and yell at each other?  I think the loudest voices in the 60s would approve.

After all, they weren’t fighting for a new uniformity.  It wasn’t a new dogma they wanted or a new set of rigid definitions of what it means to be American.  They were fighting for the freedom to keep exploring and questioning and rebelling.

I suspect that there will never again be a great American consensus.  The “culture war” that we inhabit is probably the new normal, though hopefully we’ll come up with a new name for it that doesn’t sound so hostile and ugly.  (How about the American Carnival?)

In any event, this is the backdrop to the fun we’re uncorking this month in Saranac Lake.  And it’ll help frame our conversation tonight at Historic Saranac Lake.  I hope you’ll join us and share your ideas and your memories.

42 Comments on “Why the (groovy) 60s still matter”

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  1. bill shaver says:

    The 60’s times of Mr L.B.Pearson, prince of peace, new flag in Canada, Expo 67, can’t for get that now, everybody sing that bobby Gimby song( CA-NA-DA), MR P.E .TRUDEAU..oh just watch me he said, pm’s job easier than working….he said…The quite revolution in Quebec…Expansion of Hydro Quebec, Quebec standing on its own two feet,….Flq crisis in Quebec…..But most of all the happy times of Expo 67…uncomercialized worlds fair Terre Des Hommes in montreal, all experts said it could not work but it did, youthfull optimism in spite of all the troubles that went on in 60’s….check out web site for Bobby Gimby on youtube & listen & sing along…its great….sorry you did not have that in New York in 66, but ours in montreal was how shall say more full of joi de vivre…..CA NA DA—-EVEN THE MARTIANS CAME FOR A VISIT, no one could rain on that fair and dampen its image not even the grand charlie from france, stating from montreal’s city hall stepsVIVE LE QUEBEC, VIVRE LE QUEBEC LIBRE!….Mr Pearsons rebuttal said it all, the true prince of peace & diplomate..Toronto maple leafs finnally win stanley cup…have not won since….another expo song on you tube good to listen to called HEY FREIND SAY FREIND, COME ON OVER, both songs in both languages…said it all, fixed an old problem in Canada with spending very little, mostly from the heart, said it all about us…IF YOU WANT TO YOU CAN FIX YOUR PROBLEMS AT HOME WITHOUT SPENDING A GREAT DEAL…AND TRYING TO LOOK LARGER THAN LIFE…..says whos really in charge Eh!

  2. Two Cents says:

    where’s zonker now?

  3. Peter Hahn says:

    The 60’s was also a great demographic shift. The “baby boomers” (us) became the dominant faction in the US population. Our fashions became the world’s fashions. Our music took over popular culture around the world. But the culture wars started then too.

  4. Brian Mann says:

    Two cents – Zonker’s actually in SL for carnival…I saw him (or someone who looked very much like him) sitting on the patio at the Waterhole. – Brian, NCPR

  5. bill shaver says:

    ► 2:40 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DmwxEb_2E54
    Aug 27, 2011 – 3 min – Uploaded by CanPopEncyclopedia
    The Pied Piper of Canada’s best known song. Gimby’s “Ca-na-da” was used to open Expo …

    Ca-Na-Da – Bobby Gimby- DJ K-Tel Remix – The … – YouTube

    ► 3:54 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ei6_GCauzHs
    Jul 1, 2012 – 4 min – Uploaded by DeeJayKTel
    download wav audio file: http://soundcloud.com/dj-k-tel/ca-na-da “Ca-na-da”, or ” The …
    worth looking at…

  6. Don Dew Jr. says:

    Lets also not forget about the Vietnam War. As a son of a Vietnam Veteran I spent a good part of the early 60’s watching the nightly news hour Huntley Brinkley report giving the daily body counts and praying that one of them was not my dad. Fortunately it was not.

  7. Don Dew Jr. says:

    After seein the theme as the “Groovy 60’S’ I guess the Vietnam Era might not fall into
    being groovy. Sorry for my misunderstanding.

  8. Will Doolittle says:

    Ugh. What’s more tiresome than the “greatest generation” hero worship? The nostalgia of old hippies.

  9. Ellen Rocco says:

    Don,
    I don’t know about the “groovy” but I do know we cannot talk about or remember the ’60s without Vietnam. Ultimately, more than anything else, the war shaped our generation–on the personal level (your life, for example), and on the national level.

  10. bill shaver says:

    Remember hearing on radio, singrs like Tom Jones, Frank Sinatra…Andy Williams, Perry Como…..Beatles, Pete Segar…at least in Canada…sarah Vaugn…etc, etc…tv programs like Red Skelton show, Johnathan winters, ed sullivan, Walt Disney, Hockey Night in Canada….with Danny Gallivan( from montreal)

  11. Pete Klein says:

    To my way of thinking, the only two good things to come out of the 60’s was civil rights legislation and the updating of rock & roll from the bubble gum music it was in the very early 60’s.
    Much of the promise was never fulfilled. Timothy Leary was a joke. Peace and Love never happened. Most of the hippies grew up to become money grabbing fools.
    All the wars since the end of WWII have been failures, including the wars on drugs and poverty.
    The 60’s began the dismantling of the middle class.

  12. Actually Bill, “Just Watch Me” was during the October Crisis of 1970.

    I do admit that hippie nostalgia and Greatest Generation Hero Worship can be tiresome. But they were hugely consequential in the 20th century. WWII changed the course of world history. The social upheavels of the late 60s and early 70s changed the course of American domestic history. Both were very messy but the result has been overall a better country and world.

    I do think the 60s is pretty broad for a topic. I realize decade distinctions are pretty useless. But even more so in the 60s: 1960 America was nothing like even 1967 America which itself was significantly different than 1969.

  13. bill shaver says:

    I refuse to be a skeptic, i think in canad we had things very well compared to other places, wondered why no one followed us…our neighbour to the south usa largely ignored us, have heard this from many in usa…wonder why…dont get me wrong we had some hard times there but the comments i see here people want to remember darker things, i prefer the light hearted moments..they should push out the bad memories..like the aprehened insurrection in Quebec ..the labour strikes,, st jean baptiste day riots.. etc, etc,

  14. bill shaver says:

    wow…somone in usa remembers that coment from Mr Trudeau…yes durring the flq crisis .. after the anouncment of the war measures act, queried by a journalists…Mr Trudeau said he was prepared to let bleed hearts bleed & not quibble about law & order, then asked how far he’d go…”oh just watch me”…..belive it was like this…or there abouts….The october crisis had its roots in the early 1960’s…and culminated in that crisis in october of that year, kidapping of Trade comissioner J.Cross & a week later, Quebec Minister of Labour P.Laporte.

  15. bill shaver says:

    Being in Canada in 1960’s never viewd myself in any class…but cin a class in school, we were not hyphenated, is to say we were not stupid by our own hands….a famous dissenter in quebec wrote this out in his book”THE INSOLANCES OF BROTHER SOMEBODY” check it out you’ll better understand the quite revolution in quebec. This was mr J.P.Desbien, a semenary educated man in catholic quebec( when the church ran school system),after election of Mr LeSage, he was brought into govt to form a new education system, the CEGEP Schools for post secondary education, this along with ( R.Levesque) who oversaw the expansion of hydro quebec & started the dam building boom in quebec that the other electric companies would not embark upon, the whole grid was modernized to 60 cycle pwr( outlying comunities was25 cycle), just a few of the changes in 1960’s.amongst others in govt, R.Bourassa, Gerard pelltier, Jean Marchand, Jean Cretien,

  16. I don’t remember the October Crisis, as it was before I was born. But I am a Canadian history buff. Sad to see Canada’s current PM doing far more to assault civil liberties with far less justification.

  17. bill shaver says:

    1960’s Canada the new flag…..the old Red Duster ….was good, but trade was changing, britian was allowed into The Europen comon market, commonwealth trade deminishing…the new flag represented all no matter where people came from, the old red duster in the coat of arms represented the scots, French , english & Irish…no others represented….Mr Pearsons doing…Had the inclination over the suez crisis in 1956, Mr Nasseer said he like Mr Peasons idea( yes he’s the one at the un who brought forth the idea of peackeepers) of peackeepers durring the cooling off period, but said the CANADIAN ARMY’S UNIFORM LOOKED TO ENGLISH…..this brought about the change…the maple leaf represents all as one, no hyphenated peoples, the colours red & White Presented to Rmc in Kingston I belibe from King Gerorge after the Great war 1914-1918. The offical national anthem Calixe Lavelle’s O ‘Canada, sung in both languages, yes royal families speak french, norman french….no matter where they are frome, official diplomatic language still at UN. Maple Leaf forever was never official, and represented people of english dissent.Dont get me wong, it is agood anthem, but times change…and small problems within a country must be dealt with, ( heathcare in usa) otherwaise neighbours outside will see the troubles within, & say ah ha…all not well at home….and unequivically say…one should fix problems at home first…..That they did in canada durring 1960’s..largely mr Pearsons doing, mr Trudeau further carried them out into 1970’s.Over all Mr Pearson made the country a great deal more fair for all in many ways along with implementation of heathcare for all, along with tuition free schooling at post secondary level( people pay it back vai witholding taxes when they go to work, so it isnt really free)merely means less hands touching money makes it less costlier & fed 7 state govts borrow mony at afar lesser rate than you or I…somthing to think about, tune up a string about…oscar brads song SOTHING TO SING ABOUT THIS LAND OF OURS…..ALSO FROM CANADA…

  18. bill shaver says:

    Yes it is Harpo…soon to be out….is tearing the country apart, by shaming the house of sober second thought with known miscreants( per diem scandal)….re-wrtiing history as he sees it….intimdating provincial govts to do things his way or no way to say a lillte as too many to mention here…..it’ll being troubles soon enough, but i think overall People Of Canada can see this & will vote him out this comming election, as to who will win only the big man upstairs knows for sure….Maby harpo , if he dares take a long walk in a snow storm and ponder his fate this comming election…just like Lyin Brian did……and left a woman to take the heat & the P.C part to hold their next convention in aphone booth….Yeah him taking a long walk in a snow storm…might run into Pierr….dressed in his cape, bosalino & with cane…..harpo might get the shock of his life…but too late…the word is out….devine intervention is assured, cannot be stopped by anyone…

  19. bill shaver says:

    1970’s FLQ apprehened insurection, & the war measures act…in quebec, resulted from kidnapping of British trade commisioner J.Cross & week later kidnapping & murder of Labour minister of Quebec, P.Laporte. Witnedded it first hand as delivered newspapers at the time english & french, saw the pick up of some suspects, saw the Rcmp along with town police search homes, mine on a dead end street, of which 3 familiese were fresnch speakers & 3 were English…our got searched, i answered front door & was brushed aside by man in white trench coat sporting acarbine of sorts, along with local police & soldiers of army, they walked all through house mom answered questions & they left…my mother heard the local police ask the fed ‘where next?”…gave you inclination to think they had no real plan…but to act like they were doing somthing….but in reality FLQ was thouroughly infitrated by rcmp & qpp….So they did know where they were & what their plans were…The conspiritors , one cell ws allowed to go into exile in a chosen country…they chose cuba….soon they found out what a marxist country is really like & left for fransce…they got home sick & asked to return home to quebec after the pq’sts won election in 76…they came home did jail time & got schooled in prision, some became teachers & taught in quebec…my brother had one at dawson Cegep…not very impressive he said….what can i saw be like che & wear a beret…the easy part…the day after the revolution what do you do….think about that…..no one really has a stomache for that….

  20. Mervel says:

    It’s always interesting to me to really read what was being said in the 1960’s, not just our impression of what was said. I was only in grade school in the mid 60’s so don’t remember the real facts beyond being fascinated by the long hair and smelling pot for the first time. But what I find in reading what SDS was saying what the Panthers were saying etc, the fact is the Left was a LOT more radical than they are today. Stuff like Occupy Wall street seems pretty tame, kind of lame actually. The Weather Underground was real, people listened to them. I just find that really fascinating, it seems like the 1980’s kind of put a whitewash on our memories of just how radical some of the ideas were.

    To me the biggest disappointment of the generation and the groovy 60’s, was in the end the total acceptance of materialism and consumerism by the groovy generation. They ended up demanding bigger homes and more cars and actually spend more time on their career obsessions, than the parents that they rebelled against.

  21. Mervel says:

    As far as what came out of the 1960’s, well I agree with Brian, it really was consequential, some of it for the good some of it for the bad. On balance I think the good won out. I wouldn’t want to live in the 1950’s, (for one I have daughters), but on the other hand we learned nothing from Vietnam, we are proving that every day and have been proving that for the past 13 years.

  22. bill shaver says:

    exactly just look at our behavior since 1979…the world over…

  23. Walker says:

    “…but on the other hand we learned nothing from Vietnam…”

    Well, they learned not to institute a draft. That way, you don’t stir up the general population against the war. And you use lots of contractors– that way you have even more business interests lobbying for war. And each year the right has learned more about how to control the opinions of roughly 50% of the population via Fox “News,” talk radio and various twitter feeds and websites.

    I’m afraid they learned plenty.

  24. The ’60s was the beginning of the new wave of feminism. See what Betty Friedan had to say:“The 1973 NOW annual convention closed with the playing of “I Am Woman”. “Suddenly, women got out of their seats and started dancing around the hotel ballroom and joining hands in a circle that got larger and larger until maybe a thousand of us were dancing and singing, ‘I am strong, I am invincible, I am woman.’ It was a spontaneous, beautiful expression of the exhilaration we all felt in those years, women really moving as women.” Betty Friedan from It Changed My Life, pg. 257.

  25. Mervel: You are correct. The left is very tame today. The right, on the other hand, is very aggressive. I suppose that’s why they’re mostly winning. I think what happened is simply that the left sold out to the Democratic Party, rather than holding them accountable. Unions did the same thing and their relevance has plummeted.

    Movements can work with political parties but must be independent of them. Movements are about achieving social or economic goals. Political parties are only about achieving one goal: getting elected. It’s the nature of the beasts.

  26. Mervel says:

    I think that is true Walker, the same holds for media coverage and managing criticism. For me what is interesting is that in Vietnam it was all about body counts and lying generals, who stood up every month and talked about how everything was going as planned. Now we have Generals giving data about how many Iraqi and Afghan units are “trained” and ready to go! But what is fascinating the big lesson was supposed to be never enter a war that we didn’t have an exit strategy for or where we could not define victory or know when we were to leave. Then we go and enter a war with none of those things. The domino theory was proved fatally wrong, but it seems we have that same theory going in a new way in the Middle East today, just replace Communism with Islamic Extremism.

  27. Mervel says:

    Yeah Brian MOFC I agree.

    I mean people go crazy today when you even mention the rich paying more as “redistribution”. In the 1960’s that was assumed, of course we will redistribute, we will take the pigs down and take their wealth and give it to the poor. I mean it was not subtle!

  28. Two Cents says:

    aaahh! of course! the waterhole! dive mask and snorkel in hand no doubt!

  29. Walker says:

    In the sixties, the top marginal rates were lowered from 91% to a mere 70%. So it wasn’t all that savage.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Income_tax_in_the_United_States#History_of_top_rates

  30. Two Cents says:

    my view of the sixties was that the hippies that could “tune in and drop out” did, and doing so paved the way for the yuppies and “alex keatons” of the world to rule the eighties, oops back on the regan hate rant… sorry

  31. pirateedwardlow says:

    Walker, what isn’t in that Wiki page chart —-the Deficit that was created under

    a) Reagan
    b) Bush

    Democrats are suppose to be tax and spend — but they apparently understand economics.

    Because the Goofy Obstructionist Party’s Spend and give tax breaks (to those who can afford it.) doesn’t seem to balance out.

  32. bill shaver says:

    1960’s Prez Johnson brought in medicare…too bad he could not get it for all then, had we voted for Humphrey & Muski in 68, WE’D HAVE HAD IT NOW AND THERE WOULD BE NO QUESTION….Medicare for all is greatly needed by all.

  33. knuckleheadedliberal says:

    The problem with the 60’s was that a generation decided to stop being slaves to the square status quo and started to mostly be slaves to a new image. That Elf Dentist in Rudolph summed up the 60’s most concisely, ” Let’s be independent together.”

  34. knuckleheadedliberal says:

    And believe me, square had and still has a strong hold on the Adirondacks.

  35. knuckleheadedliberal says:

    I avoided reading this post til now because there is not much that annoys me more than tie dye, except maybe old people in tie dye. (Okay, truth be told lots of stuff annoys me. But anyway…)

    Tie dye represents so much that was wrong with hippie culture – people so stoned they thought their ideas were really deep, man. In fact they were wearing shoddy clothes. The generation that decided to learn new craft mostly lost the conception of Craft, substituting it with macrame and tie dye and it all looked so cool after smoking a doobie, brother! The 60’s was just a generation catching up with the ideas of people from a decade or two or three before and missing most of the message.

    All that groovy crap was just as conformist as a flat top and a suit. Now the Black Panthers, they were some solid brothers and sisters. Angela Davis, baby.

  36. bill shaver says:

    just remember the happy times in canada ……
    was not conformity…but a joyous celebration in spite of all that was going on in the world…………..everone else was having troubles …we were to,,,but the expsition said it all….truely a great time….listen to the tunes on you tube if you dare …you might just laugh & remember the good times…..

    ► 2:40 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DmwxEb_2E54
    Aug 27, 2011 – 3 min – Uploaded by CanPopEncyclopedia
    The Pied Piper of Canada’s best known song. Gimby’s “Ca-na-da” was used to open Expo …

    Ca-Na-Da – Bobby Gimby- DJ K-Tel Remix – The … – YouTube

    ► 3:54 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ei6_GCauzHs
    Jul 1, 2012 – 4 min – Uploaded by DeeJayKTel
    download wav audio file: http://soundcloud.com/dj-k-tel/ca-na-da “Ca-na-da”, or ” The …
    worth looking at…

  37. Mervel says:

    I think you are a little hard on them Knuckle.

    There were some true believers there, people who sacrificed their safety and security for a cause. It’s hard to make generalizations about an entire decade and millions of people though.

  38. Two Cents says:

    the sixties are a mere marketing ploy, fashion recycle and an inside joke to be used to the advantage of everything, everyone they stood against. evidence in their very use by the carnival.
    give the people what they want– or should I say sell it to them…….
    even beloved pot use has become a caricature of itself
    can you say commercialization children?
    reminds me of groucho’s comment about not wanting to belong to a club that would consider me for membership.

  39. bill shaver says:

    I say one thing for people we elected in canada durring 1960’s they acted from the hearts and did not act just to appease & get votes, the important ones….we had men of valor in high exalted positions…you did in usa too, but we had better ones…not crowing ‘but comenting …and remembering…the good & the bad times….WISH WE HAD THEM TODAY though as people like that are badly needed in the decison process of existing in the current world we live in.

  40. Mitch Edelstein says:

    No question that the major achievement of the times was the change in woman’s right and position in society. Remember the ERA – Equal Rights Amendment. Well look at girls participation in school sports. When I was in High School (65-69) girls might play field hockey in short skirts. Now they participate in everything but football (smart). Conservatives then opposed this change, now they brag about their granddaughters win record. Is there anyone who thinks woman/girls participation in sports was a bad thing?

  41. Will Doolittle says:

    thanks KHL. Maybe it’s coming on the tail end of the ’60s era — I was 10 in 1970 — that makes it seem so unappealing. The folks I met who advocated hippie ideals seemed to be using the philosophy as an excuse to get high and hang out while getting little of substance done. The rebelliousness of the period, at least among white middle-class and rich kids, was I think mostly a reaction against the military draft. If the power brokers had been smart enough to have mostly the working class kids getting blown up — like now — then all that demonstrating against “the man” would never have happened. The women’s liberation and civil rights movements were separate and a whole lot more inspiring and significant than the peace, love, I’d rather not have to go to work movement.

  42. bill shaver says:

    with all the so called protesting going on then canada as well in usa…surpised no one was up in arms about heathcare….as they should have been, even now…it should be brining people to action…as is many more things that are wrong in our society instead of just buruying our heads in the sand…., having an attiitude likeI GOT mine…TOO BAD FOR YOU…

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