Planning for hard times in the North Country
Picking through the rubble of yesterday’s special session in Albany, it’s hard not to be very, very worried. The problem in a nutshell, is that the North Country relies on the legislature and the administration for the lion’s share of our vitality.
Here’s how state Senator Betty Little puts it:
“We rely on government. Our economy is based on goverment jobs.”
Ouch, right? It’s painful to see it laid out there so bluntly. Like much of rural America, we’ve grown dangerously dependent on government spending.
And with Albany and Washington verging on bankruptcy, people are scratching their heads about what to do in the post-Big Government era. Here again is Sen. Little speaking on Monday:
“I don’t know how you prepare for it, because when it happens it’s devastating to those who lose their jobs or those who have to move…We don’t have other jobs to go to because we don’t have that growth in the private sector that we need to have.”
Little says important next steps are easing taxes and regulations so more private sector businesses will choose the North Country.
Those strike me as reasonable things to talk about. But it seems that a much bigger regional planning process is called for here.
What are our assets? Which communities have some private sector vitality that could be built-upon. Is it time to concede that some communities, where government is all that is left, are simply no longer viable?
Put simply, government is our version of Michigan’s automobile industry. That era appears to be over. My guess is that we don’t have a lot of time to plan and prepare for what comes next.
Tags: economy
Agree. We need to identify what our competitive advantage is here in the North Country.
I’ll go out on a limb and make short-list to get this started:
Forest Preserve
Lake Champlain Valley
High Peaks
Access to Wilderness – wide variety of use.
Historical and Cultural resources (only semi-developed in many cases)
Resilient residents
Proximity to population centers
Higher Education (develop, nurture, and promote our college-towns)
I dont see how lower taxes and less regulations (at least by themselves) gets us anywhere. Regional planning, per se, doesnt do much either. Ultimately it will take some investment in infrastructure. The park can revert to a pure tourism-based economy, although without ORDA and whiteface/gore….
I would add to tourpro’s list proximity to Canada. Ogdensburg is a little over one hour from the capital city and high-tech center of the US’s largest trade partner. Malone is 90 minutes to one of the most important commercial and shipping centers of that country. Its major trans-continental highway is minutes from Massena and Ogdensburg. We need to figure out how we can make NAFTA a benefit to the North Country.
While you won’t get some around here, including Betty Little, to ever see it this way, one of our assets IS our regulation.
The Park.
The Park is what makes us unique and attractive. It is what separates us from rural anywhere town USA. Yet instead of marketing that, people seem to want to run from it… hide it… change it.
We should be flying that flag as high as we can – highlighting what makes this area different and attracting people and businesses who appreciate it.
That we don’t do that (at least not in any coordinated, competent way) has been one of the more perplexing observations since moving here.
I agree with all of the above and would add on the tourism front more marketing to NYC and its minorities.
Marketing aimed at the city not only reaches those who live and work there. It also reaches out nationally and worldwide to all who visit the number one tourist attraction in the state and possibly the country.
Sell what we have, not what we don’t have. Sell the sizzle, not the steak.
The lower taxes/no regulation/cheap labor route to compete with the Southern US, Mexico, and China, seems hopeless. Who wants that kind of a life anyway? Take advantage of the local beauty/great place to live, and Invest in the colleges and universities. Put in a top of the line high speed internet system so that high tech startups dont have to relocate if they get to be successful.
I am not too hopeful about anything that relies on cheap fossil fuels, such as tourism and I do wonder if we haven’t attracted interest of Ottawa and Montreal by now, maybe it isn’t going to happen. The North Country has other assets. Biomass, grass or wood, could give our existing businesses a cushion and competitive edge. We could produce more of our own food. Both of these would keep more dollars in the region, and create additional jobs Implied in both of these is a revival of regional agriculture. The commodity and export folks and small farmers need to bridge the distrust gap and realize both are needed and can thrive in NNY. We also need to identify and support entrepreneurs that will create and keep jobs here. The region’s colleges could help here. Some of our best success stories were started on someone’s kitchen table. As much as possible we need to support local and regional businesses with our household spending.
DBW, you want that local food you better be calling Washington and urging our Senators to vote against S510.
I think most of you are dreaming. Invest in our college towns? More educational welfare? High speed internet? For who? We live in the 2nd highest taxed state in the nation IIRC. WHY would anyone relocate a business here with our ridiculous regulations and taxes?
Tourism is fine, a wonderful thing. But tourists want state of the art, modern, easy to get to destinations. We lack that. The forestry and mining industries are about dead. Transportation costs are rising as our roads deteriorate and our rail systems lower traffic.
I don’t mean to be negative, but these are the same worn out ideas I’ve heard for 20+ years. Between distance, costs, regulations and taxes, environment and, frankly, the less than “sizzling” ambiance (read that- a good portion of the North Country looks like mid 60s Appalachia) we have a real problem. The woods and waters themselves are fine, but anyone whose been to the more developed tourist regions, even Vermont, can see the difference. If you want to draw people you have to either have something modern to draw them (and who pays for that), something out of the long dead past (Colonial Willaimsburg, etc), or really cheap living. We’re someplace in the middle to bottom of that pile.
What will happen is that some money and effort will be haphazardly thrown at a number of endeavors, effort will be wasted and in the end not much will be accomplished. Why? No leadership. Pick something, whatever it is, and drive towards that. Find someone who can push the idea HARD and get the political backing to do it, whatever it is. Where you find the person I don’t know. What the best plan is I don’t know. I do know that whats best for the tourist industry isn’t going to do much for the loggers, farmers, factory workers. And whats best for higher ed won’t help them either, same for agriculture, it won’t help tourism or education. Maybe a multi-pronged approach would be better, but then your dividing troops and resources.
So if someone can find some leadership to work on this I think you’d best get in gear and get going now. I hate to sound like I’m saying someone else should do the work, but this is a job for Superman.
“High speed internet? For who? We live in the 2nd highest taxed state in the nation IIRC. WHY would anyone relocate a business here with our ridiculous regulations and taxes?”
Bret, My taxes were higher before I moved to this area… and where I came from is considered one of the tech/bio/intellectual industries capitals of the world. They have no problem attracting and fostering business despite having higher taxes.
Furthermore, wouldn’t a more stable economy, no matter how it is achieved – tourism, high tech – benefit local farmers like yourself in the long run?
Had a conversation this past weekend with a relative that is head of a R&D division in a company with over 2000 employees. They are adding a product production line but it won’t be in New York. Why? The NYS regulatory environment is too costly and time consuming. My relative told me that without significant regulatory reform the company will inevitably have to pull up stakes and leave the state. The belief that the even more onerous regulatory nature of the Adirondack Park is an asset is wishful thinking.
Speaking for the Adirondacks I think the plan is simple. Look at other parts of the country where they have a successful tourist economy.
Let’s take skiing as an example. The two largest ski areas in the Adirondacks are owned by the state. Is it any big surprise that they don’t live up to their full potential??
They lack slope-side accommodations, key to a successful ski area. Why don’t they have slope-side accommodations? Because of regulations. It is not legal to build slop-side at Whiteface or Gore. The state does not allow it. Out west where we have successful ski operations they have regulations that PROMOTE the industry. Federal land is leased to the ski areas for development. NYS should lease some of its land (or better yet sell some of its land) to private companies to develop the industry.
Until we start making moves like that we will continue to slide downhill economically.
Any plan for the future should include halting immediately the implementation of new and increased regulations, mandates, taxes, and fees. After that, state “leaders” should conduct a top to bottom review of all existing state regulations and mandates Those that cannot be justified should be sent to the trash bin of history. A more reasonable regulatory environment, fewer mandates on local governments, and lower litigation costs well help all areas of the state, especially the north country.
With respect to the north country, more needs to be done to develop infrastructure, partner businesses with local SUNY colleges, universal broadband, and promoting entreprenuership. There is room to develop tourist based businesses, artistic based businesses, and wineries. I think wineries would not only provide a product to export, but also promote more tourism. We have some excellent wineries in the North Country, it’s too bad we don’t we only have have a handful (only three that I’m aware of).
Forest Products.
Alive and well.
Lets take the terrorists in our old prisons.
Seriously though it depends on the type of government jobs we are talking about. What I mean is are we talking about federal, state, county or village, and what type of categories within those?
Some prisons may close, but NYS will always need prisons and we will always have a prison industry up here. Fort Drum is a federal facility and given our war footing is on very solid ground. Social security, Medicare and Medicaid may fall but not in the near future but not right now plus they are mainly federal with the exception of Medicaid.
So really we are talking about government spending that comes directly from Albany. That would be the state institutions such as the prisons and sunmount, it would include reductions in school aid from the state, it would include reductions in state aid to county DSS, it would include the SUNY system; it would also include the numerous state contracts parceled out to not for profits in the North Country.
But none of those are totally going away with the possible exception of Sunmount and a prison or two. Painful indeed but very survivable.
I would be looking to an immediate plan to help people re-locate or transition to other skill sets with the emphasis on relocation. We will also have to plan on how to get smaller without looking like a dump ala Buffalo. There are models within the rust belt for shrinking and transitioning to smaller cleaner thriving communities.
Dave, individual areas may have higher taxes than, say, Macomb or Newcomb or Morehouse. But overall I believe NYS is the 2nd highest taxed state in the Union. Maybe it’s #3, does it matter? And let me ask you, where you came from- did you get more services for your tax dollar? I don’t know where you live now or came from, but my $4K land and school taxes get me a plowed road and my kids go to school. That’s it. No trash pickup, no water, sewer, free internet or wireless, no municipal play grounds, pools, activities, the fire house is 14 miles away. What does you tax dollar get you elsewhere? What would draw someone to this area to create a business? Low taxes? Nope. A highly skilled labor force? Nope. Cheap power? Nope. Easy to deal with regulations? Nope. Plenty of affordable, quality housing? Nope. Great schools? Nope. Wide open spaces where people can ride their ATVS, horses, snowmobiles in the wilds on their off hours like they can out west? Nope. Easy winters? Nope. Good roads and easy access to air and train travel? Nope. Modern port facilities? Nope.
Whats to draw people here instead of 100,000 other places? I agree, we have lots of gorgeous scenery, wonderful people, fertile lands, lots of land that will probably never see a human footprint again much less be developed. But whats to draw people here for either a business or tourism?
The Adirondacks are one of the best outdoor vacation destinations in the East.
Bret,
According to the Tax Foundation’s “Tax Freedom Day” New York is 3rd (April 23). Connecticut is first (April 27) and New Jersey second (April 25). National average is April 9th. Rounding out the top 10 are Maryland 4th, Washington 5th, Massachusetts 6th, California 7th, Minnesota 8th, Vermont 9th, and Virginia 10th.
Forbes has a “Debt Weight Scorecard”
The 10 worst states going from worst to best:
Illinois, New York, Connecticut, California, New Jersey, Louisiana, Mississippi, Ohio, Massachusetts, and Wisconsin.
Hoooo Boy! We made the top of TWO lists!!! Oh……wait……I guess that’s actually kinda the bottom of the list………………rats.
Mervel, for SOME people it’s great. No offense man, but my wifes idea of a vacation doesn’t include bugs, frost, mud, Bi-Centennial era hotels and motels, and the inability to simply drive to the the scenic view from the top of some High Peak. What I mean that not everyone is a 20 something mid level executive with the latest outfit off the cover of “Outside” and the drive to become a 46er in one summer. And even then we’re limited in what is allowed. In fact, I’ll give you a good example of the problem- back when I worked in Tupper I got a trespass complaint off one of the big private holdings down there. Two research veterinarians from Rochester decided to mountain bike on some private land and got arrested. They swore they would never return to the Adirondacks under any circumstances and I believe them. If they’d been mountain biking on any State land they would have gotten nabbed too according to the local Ranger. Dang sure you can’t take a horse for a ride on State land. Our laws limit what can be done and that hurts our chances. Not a good thing or bad, but it’s reality and we have to take that into consideration. Whether it’s the “you can’t do that here” or the fact that we aren’t set up like a National Park where the lands can actually be used, it’s just the reality. Same thing Paul mentions with slope side accommodations- we’re limited, hamstrung would be more accurate.
I wish it was as simple as “look at all the unspoiled wilderness!!!” but it’s not that easy. Again, I’m not trying to be negative, just realistic, because this is all very real and it’s going to get a lot more “real” for a whole bunch of people and there are a lot of people that are going to DEMAND tax dollars be spent to combat this. If you can balance out my natural cynicism with some fresh, workable ideas I would be more than happy to listen.
Oh man! Betty Little is crying because the North Country lives by sucking at the government teat and the cow is drying up. Sounds like socialism to me.
Brian are you suggesting that we eliminate unnecessary levels of government?
Are you serious? Because every village I have heard about that has done the study (read: spent tens of thousands of dollars) to see if consolidation will be effective has decided against. It may be necessary but I don’t believe it is possible to get rid of, say, Hamilton County.
We don’t need more regional planning. That is just more people in cheap suits sucking more money out of our pockets. We need people to stand up and do for themselves.
The one thing government could do would be to provide health care to all new start-up businesses.
Paul,
Whiteface is consistently named one of the top ski destination in the East – this past year it was ranked #1 in the east and #2 in North America.
When talking about Whiteface’s high ranking, here is how Ski Magazine addressed the very topic you bring up: “and remember, in the 6 million-acre Adirondack Park, slopeside sprawl is forbidden, so the scenery is unspoiled.”
Sounds to me like the people who actually know something about the topic of skiing disagree with your entire statement.
Dave, that’s one persons take on it. One magazine named it #1, what did all the other ski magazines rate it? And if slopeside accommodations are so bad then why do places like Vail out west do so well?
If Whiteface and the Park are such marvels, then why is the idea of holding the Olympics here again considered laughable? For the some of the some reasons I mentioned- poor roads, poor accommodations, poor transportation, limited space, etc. Plus- the State can shut down Whiteface and Gore in a heartbeat. Do they actually make money? I don’t know.
We can work with what we have, but we also need to be realistic about it.
Bret,
You sure are a downer.
I find it interesting – if a bit exhausting – that even when we have a nationally recognized asset like this, you, Paul, and others can’t help but be negative about it.
Sorry man. It IS an asset, but we need to be realistic about it’s limitations. The fact it’s illegal to make use of all the State land in more than a very limited manner is only an asset if you happen to be someone who is an enthusiast for that particular manner of use. We don’t have, for instance, a lot of places Grammy and Gramps can drive to and picnic or fish or get a good view of things. We don’t have the more liberal land use regs like the BLM lands out west. It’s a blessing in one sense and curse in another. We certainly can’t log our State lands, can we? We can’t build those slopeside accommodations at the States largest ski areas, which the State owns and operates, a fine bit of unrecognized socialism there.
I know I’m a cynic. I try not to be, but it’s just the way I am. Give me some fresh ideas and views on things and I’ll gladly listen. But the same old hashed out lines and ideas don’t seem to hold much merit these days.
Bret, but those are changes that are pretty easy to fix or modify.
ATV’s, horses, snowmobiles, biking; are all things to look at as far loosening up restrictions and they would not cost a dime to change.
Plus I am not a 20 something midlevel executive with the latest outfit from outside, and I still love to hike in the Adirondacks. I think you have this stereotype in your mind of who is out in the woods hiking. But you know mid level executives have discretionary income we need to get more of them up here!
You know we have the largest stand of old growth forest in the Eastern US in the five ponds area, I have spent the last five years exploring that region and there is still so much more to go. I don’t know I have a hard time being totally down about the area even with the challenges.
The bottom line is though there is no one thing that is going to replace the government jobs they pay well and have good benefits, we should be looking at how to transition to a smaller populated area in the least painful way.
Bret – the north country has one and only one asset – the adirondack park. Any “development” must not come at the expense of the park or it will be counterproductive i.e. lead to less economic activity rather than more. Thats not to say that parts cant be made more accessible to couch potatoes. But no one is going to build an ipod factory in these mountains – even if taxes and regulations go to zero.
and .. the private real estate development/ski slope concept is being tried by the Big Tupper group. Its obviously harder to pull off within the park because of the APA etc., but without the park no one would be interested in even attempting it. I think there are a couple of them outside the park – like Titus – but they arent doing very well.
The North Country has many assets: thousands of acres of underutilized ag and forest land, several colleges that educate our children and benefit the region, and a hardworking populace just to mention a few–all that are undervalued and deeply discounted. Even by many folks who live here. We may never look like the wealthy suburbs to the south of us but we have the possibility of building healthy, sustainable communities.
I don’t buy it that regulation and taxation are limiting our options. Northern Vt, NH, and Maine all struggle too–and they are not laboring under the burden of an oppressive Albany.
While we love to beat up on downstate, our whole way of life in the North Country is subsidized by the suburbs of Albany, Syracuse, Rochester, and Buffalo. We receive 4x as much in state money as residents payout. For decades, we have had a very good deal.
In many ways New York, the Empire State is a victim of its own success. Our large population has meant more laws and regulation. Our history of economic vitality has meant higher wages and higher prices. The taxes of our residents subsidize the other impoverished states that hate us. We send the federal government $89 more than is returned to us. A modest fraction of that would more than wipe out our state deficits. Higher wages and higher prices have meant that it has been easy for other states to undercut us, attracting our businesses. Yet the option, of participating in a race to the bottom is not very appealing. It may be all well and good for a retiree to move to South Carolina, but I will take a NYS school education any time for my own children.
The US is in the same position with the poorer countries. Once again victims of our own success. Globalization and free trade has caused a lot of our current difficulties.
As for the North Country, we may have to try to figure this out for ourselves. We sit up here thinking we aren’t that different from other places because we can get cable, but we really are a place apart. I have seen successful business people come here and struggle. I have no illusions about our situation, but too much negative thinking leads to hopelessness and giving up.
Correction: We sent other states $89 BILLION more than we receive back from the federal government.
Mervel, really? Are you REALLY trying to say that with little effort State lands could be opened to ATV’s, Mtn Bikes, horses, etc??????? Really? With all due respect my friend, hell will freeze over before one tiny step is ever taken in that direction. I’m sorry but that a completely unrealistic proposal. As for my sterotype, maybe. But back when I was guiding raft trips on the Upper Hudson, hanging out at the cross country and downhill shops and serving the tourists in my best humble serf manner the majority of the folks tended to be something other than mid 50’s blue collar workers. My apologies if I offended you personally.
Phan, I get confused. Not long ago people were here telling me there was no use even trying to get the Foxman project through because it would never work for the good of the community, and that the APA was not an problem at all and now you say it is a problem and sort of give the idea that maybe the Tupper project might not be so bad after all. Sometimes I lose track of the players in this game.
That is what you get with a progressive tax system.
DBW,
NYS is not a high wage state. The bottom 20% of New Yorkers earn less than the bottom 20% in Nebraska workers for example.
We have one of the highest income inequalities in the nation. We are in the top 25% of states in childhood poverty. We don’t treat our low income working people well, the South and the Midwest often times do better.
So this idea that we are victims of our success is not true, unless you count the success of the very rich. It is truly Eastern elitism and parochialism that prevents us from really looking at the fact that on the ground we are not progressive at all, the rich make out very well in NYS and the poor are treated badly.