Could Elizabeth Warren topple Hillary Clinton? Probably not.

Can Massachusetts Sen. Elizabeth Warren topple Hillary Rodham Clinton?

Can Massachusetts Sen. Elizabeth Warren topple Hillary Rodham Clinton?

In 2008, Hillary Rodham Clinton was almost as sure a bet as she is going into 2016.  The former first lady, US Senator, and later Secretary of State was beloved among rank-and-file Democrats.  Unlike Al Gore, who edged away from the legacy of Bill Clinton, Hillary Clinton was happy to embrace his popularity and his centrist politics.

But in the end, she lost to Barack Obama.  And as we build toward the Democratic primary next year, a lot of progressives are suggesting that the same thing could happen again.  A candidate from the party’s left flank – Elizabeth Warren or Bernie Sanders – could step in with a powerful populist message and claim the nomination.

I think that’s unlikely for a lot of reasons.  But the biggest flaw in that political calculation is that it badly misremembers what actually happened in 2008.  It gets wrong why Hillary lost to Barack.  And it turns out that fixing her clumsy strategy – her losing strategy – isn’t all that difficult.

Translation?  Hillary Clinton isn’t likely to fumble the ball on the goal line a second time.

What people remember, what actually happened

The memory that most people have of 2008 is of hope and change and Barack Obama’s soaring speeches.  And he did turn out to be a strong, powerful campaigner.  But that’s not how he won.  He won because early in the primary, Hillary Clinton’s team made a fatal strategic error.

She launched herself into the Democratic primary confident that she had built a solid team in the big Democratic states.  New York, her adopted home state, was a lock.  So was California.  She had also built a solid ground game in Florida, a state that Democrats dearly hoped to win in the general election.

And that all worked pretty much as planned.  Look at the map of Clinton’s eventual wins and it pretty much looks like a map of Democratic Party politics in the 21st century.  Massachusetts?  Check.  Michigan?  Check.  Pennsylvania?  Check.  Ohio?  Check.

It’s not that Obama didn’t win some Democratic states.   He did.  In every primary, the frontrunner drops a handful of states.  But what gave Obama the margin overall was a brilliant stealth campaign designed to pick up low-cost, often uncontested delegates in red-hot conservative states.

Obama’s red state strategy

As the primary results began to roll in through 2008, it became clearer and clearer that Obama was winning fewer popular votes from Democrats than Clinton, particularly in the states that would actually vote Democratic in November.

But by racking up small, chip-shot victories in places like Idaho, Kansas, North Dakota, Utah and Wyoming, the still largely-

This chart from Wikipedia illustrates how Obama won the Democratic primary, by capturing lots of small, red states and battling strategically for a handful of actual Democratic states.  Source:  Wikipedia http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Northwest-historian

This chart from Wikipedia illustrates how Obama won the Democratic primary, by capturing lots of small, red states and battling strategically for a handful of actual Democratic states. Source: Wikipedia http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Northwest-historian

unknown Senator from Illinois was socking away enough delegates to keep him in the game.

He also brilliantly deployed activists in states that used caucuses rather than actual primary votes to assign their delegates.  That meant he could pick up disproportionate numbers of delegates, when compared to his popularity, while spending relatively few campaign dollars.

A great illustration of how this worked came in Texas.  Clinton actually won that state’s primary pretty handily, by roughly a 51% to 47% margin. But after the complex mechanics of that state’s Democratic Party process had churned (Texas has a primary and caucuses), Obama actually emerged with more delegates, 99 to Clinton’s 94.

Click the graph at the right and you’ll get a visual sense of just how badly Clinton’s team was outplayed over and over.

It was a contest where Clinton’s strategists did everything right according to the old Democratic playbook, winning plenty of votes and winning the biggest states.  But they still couldn’t deliver a knock-out punch.

Obama’s plan eventually forced Clinton to campaign more and more aggressively.  She scrambled, belatedly, to try to win more small, conservative states.  She began making mistakes on the stump as the math turned against her.

The loss that finally forced her to concede?  It came in Montana, a state that Obama won handily in the primary, but which hasn’t voted for a Democratic president since 1992.

Brilliant politics, but could it happen again?

obamainoval_375It’s important to point out that Barack Obama didn’t cheat his way into the White House.  Rather, he exploited a muddly, byzantine Democratic primary system brilliantly, developing a ground game that was perfectly designed to squeeze as much advantage as possible from wins in states that most Democrats neglected, like Alaska and Oklahoma.

Meanwhile, his team focused their scant resources in a calculated bid to pick off a few actual Democratic states.  It was, in political terms, pure genius.

Even so, this long march strategy probably would have been impossible if Obama himself weren’t rooted in two significant Democratic states, Hawaii and Illinois, which he won without much effort. And it’s important to note that even with this “I’m playing chess and you’re playing checkers” ground game, Obama barely won.  It was a near thing.

So what does this say about Hillary in 2016?

It says that fixing her losing primary strategy is actually fairly easy.  There is no evidence that she had a flawed message or a broken political brand, or that she was an inadequate candidate on the stump.  Those are things that politicians struggle mightily to repair.

Clinton’s task is much easier.  Her team simply needs to organize a stronger primary effort – caucus supporters, local campaign staff, etc. – in half a dozen small, red states.  That will allow her to build on near-certain wins in California and New York in a way that won’t leave plenty of fertile territory in the Heartland for a well-organized insurgent.

Can someone beat Hillary in a head-to-head match-up?

SOURCE:  US STATE DEPARTMENT

SOURCE: US STATE DEPARTMENT

Without being able to borrow from Barack Obama’s ingenious red-state playbook, a progressive like Warren or Sanders will have to fight Hillary head-to-head.

They’ll have to battle to win at least one or two monster blue states like California, Illinois, Ohio or Pennsylvania.  (Warren might be able to count on a win in her home state of Massachusetts, but it’s hardly a sure thing.)

That kind of straight-up mano a mano strategy is far more expensive and complex and confrontational.  It’s also a fight that will be far more difficult to sustain after one or two big losses. And there will be far less time for an insurgent to hone a working message and develop a sense of momentum.

Sanders or Warren will have to get it right almost from the outset.  That’s a big contrast from Obama’s method, which allowed him months in which to build his war chest and grown his brand and name recognition.

The bottom line is that Hillary Rodham’s team was badly outsmarted eight years ago.  They were wildly over-confident.  If Clinton runs again, she’ll certainly be more wary, more thorough.  She won’t leave lots of poker chips lying on the table unclaimed.

Unless her opponents come up with a new edge, a cunning new Obama-style strategy, they’ll actually have win straight.  That means convincing a majority of Democrats that Hillary Rodham Clinton’s time has passed.  The party faithful will have to reject her outright.

Obama’s virtuoso campaign essentially allowed him to go around Clinton.   Her next challenger will have to go straight through her.  That kind of attack message will be painfully tricky, given Clinton’s deep roots and loyalty in the party’s base.

67 Comments on “Could Elizabeth Warren topple Hillary Clinton? Probably not.”

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  1. FreedomToThink says:

    The diatribe going on in this forum is proof positive that there is no hope left for this country. The same old tired, worn out BS. Another four years of our lives with another lying RNC puppet or another lying DNC puppet. And then we’ll do it again, and again, and again.

  2. Two Cents says:

    this country can not elect one female as president. so I don’t see the choice between one or the other as necessary.
    I doubt whole heartedly that two on the same ticket would make it out the barn.
    i’ll vote for whom ever agrees to tell McCain to go away, rep. or dem.
    then rubio, paul, palin…..Cuomo, Emanuel, booker, SANDERS!!

    marvel, so it was you who voted for nader??!!!! :) what about vermin supreme… ? anybody??
    this whole sham is like BAD theater, where at the end of the play, the audience finds out their coat pockets were picked by the hat check girl.

  3. The Original Larry says:

    You really don’t think we can elect a woman? I do; and if we do, I hope it is because people see her as the best person for the job.

  4. Mervel says:

    Two Cents, I only voted for Nader once. He is kind of addictive, I voted for him as a protest vote, but then I started listening to him.

    I thought Brian’s analysis was pretty good, but I think it shows that Hillary Clinton will win handily in the primary races, she can pick up the red states and lock in the big blue ones.

  5. Two Cents says:

    I swore as a teen I would not vote in any election until a woman ran.
    I lasted till I was forced to vote against Reagan, “the great culler” of society. he sifted us all like clams- chowders, little necks, seed clams. he didn’t stop Russia, he just outspent them.
    I always felt, and this is as sexist as it gets, that a woman would concentrate domestically, cleaning up the mess left by others.
    now i’m not too sure, watching hillary, anne richards, liz dole, Napolitano, and a host of others, are no different than any man in politics. new “girls” like palin, condie rice, and others were thrown at us by their parties as if to say “see we like ladies too”, but they’re as closed minded as any man. they are the equivalent of political arm candy.
    they had to be, in order to play with the boys. shame. I don’t believe now that gender makes a difference. maybe cause I’m older and even more bitter, and comparing any woman to thatcher is kin to admitting they are a man, as was thatcher!
    yes, nader, I think, should at least be a cabinet member.

  6. The Original Larry says:

    “he didn’t stop Russia, he just outspent them.”

    A win is a win, ask anyone in New England. You don’t have to love everything about someone to acknowledge their successes. No leader is perfect.

  7. Mervel says:

    I think that’s true, I don’t think it matters or it least only very marginally so.

    In our government today there is a natural force which continually pushes toward world military expansion, its not any big secret. We have soldiers and military assets on every part of the globe, many actively involved in quasi and direct military actions all of the time. Once you go down that road its hard to turn the ship around, look how hard it is to cancel even one weapon’s system.

    I don’t think Hillary Clinton will pull back the military a we should, but the fact is in my opinion she is pretty competent and I think she is a deal maker, she likes to get things done and I do think she will compromise to do so.

  8. Two Cents says:

    larry,
    both the coach and the QB are cheats.

  9. bill shaver says:

    WOW…I’m eternally optimistic on this, as always, but cannot belive all the fear i’m hearing here…and its all for not…as change is coming, its the 21’st century. Wow Somone out there really sees what the reagan years were about…I’m eternally optimistic about the futuure of two women in the whithouse…The current GOP NASCAR RACE leads tpo a wreck before the finnish line as always.

  10. Mervel says:

    Larry is right about Reagan however, at least as far as his dealings with the Soviet Union and some of his other successes. I mean he could have stayed in Lebanon for some long term middle east quagmire, he could have been jumping into a whole bunch of places, but didn’t do so. In many respects he is much more like Obama in those dealings, utilizing special forces and covert operations, versus these insane occupations and of course the never ending scam of “training” foreign troops. We have never really successfully trained a foreign army with the exception of the death squads in central and south america. Outside of that; getting trained by the US military is the kiss of death for any army.

  11. Two Cents says:

    reagan never put troops in middle east maybe because
    1- he was freekin senile and alzheimered by then?
    2- he had the ex cia head/vp/invisible hand running the whole shebang for him anyway?
    3-russia was up to their borsch in afghanistan fighting the future taliban
    4-now fast forward to when those tribes he supported to fight against russia and their ilk, fly a plane into a sky scraper
    the man was from the government and he was here to help– remember that line of sh*t?

    of course it doesn’t matter how you win…so I’ve been told!
    he was an elitist @ss

  12. Two Cents says:

    didn’t we train the pilots that flew into wtc?
    that worked well–for them

  13. knuckleheadedliberal says:

    Two Cents, the tribes in Afghanistan had as much to do with 9/11 as the Iraqis did…nothing.

  14. bill shaver says:

    oh boy….we’ll just have to wait till election night in 2016…..

  15. Two Cents says:

    knuck,
    everything touches. it became my mantra.
    when I’d build an addition on a home, it would be built level, plumb, and square.
    the existing home– maybe wasn’t, or settled over time. if the job (very often more than not) did not include straightening out the primary structure, one of two things happened:
    either the new straight work looked fine, and emphasized how wracked the main house was
    or
    the bulk of the crooked house made the small extension look tweaked and the house looked straight(er) in comparison.
    the art was how you made the two touch, because they had to touch.
    that’s my view of the cesspool that is the middle east.

    ..and time will show they are/were all in cahoots at some level.
    this has gotten off topic, sorry brian. i’ll let it rest.

  16. bill shaver says:

    either way i think shou could really win,,, no one in the GOP 500 NASCAR RACE…CAN BEAT HER…EVEN RICCKY BOOBY…

  17. bill shaver says:

    Woops….bad key board & glasses..too early in am, anyhow Mrs warren, either Her Or MrsClinton…as Prez would be fine…either way they give the GOP 500 NASCAR RACE a run for thier mony, probbably causeing a car wreck in every aspect of it to happen, we all know how the Gop contenders are, leapords dont change their spots……

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